I love your willingness to disprove your theories!
I have an anecdote to share about the shifting sleep an hour every day and carnivore. I’ve had the same thing my whole life, which I assumed is because of a variant of the CLOCK gene I have. People send me their genetic data sometimes to troubleshoot their chronic illness because that’s how I recovered from many of my issues. I can say that I’ve only seen two other people with the CLOCK gene variant I have, and they also have the same sleeping issue.
However, for the record, I have another genetic issue that could affect circadian rhythms, which is nonclassical congenital adrenal hyperplasia via 21-hydroxylase deficiency. That’s the enzyme that makes cortisol, so I don’t get the spike you’re supposed to get upon waking. Rather, when tested my body struggles all day to get my shitty enzymes to react, meaning I finallt get a cortisol spike around the time I ought to want to go to bed.
I did carnivore for six months back in 2019 and after about three months I would wake up at dawn feeling rested. Diet somehow overcome two big genetic influences.
My carnivore was only slightly strict by that point, however, and iirc around three months is also when I got cravings for greens and would sometimes make a pot of pigs feet with bitter greens and diced tomatoes.
I’ve never properly experimented with fiber in mind because mostly fiber used to destroy my GI lining, though I handle it fine now. And I don’t really pay attention to fat versus protein, just follow my appetite going through phases where I crave fat versus being a little averse to it.
Thanks! It's harder than it looks, because I'm really attached to my theories ;)
Interesting that you have the same/a similar issue. I think these are super rare, at least diagnosed. Most people who have circadian rhythm issues probably never get diagnosed and just go through life feeling tired and shitty the whole time.
So is your rhythm still under control now? Sounds like you gave up on carnivore? I've never gotten my genes tested, so not sure if that's the issue I have. But it could be.
Yeah, the other two people with the same CLOCK gene never had anything diagnosed, they just feel like life is more difficult, heh. I never had anything diagnosed either, I figured I just took after my father (which is apparently accurate as my mom does not have the variant).
It's actually never been especially important in my life to get my circadian rhythm under control; by the time I was in my 20s I was nearly bedbound from chronic illness so it didn't really matter which 16 to 20 hours of the day I slept. Then once my health recovered it was still too tenuous to keep a job; I have a recurring brain infection whenever I get cold sores and one outbreak wrecks me for months at a time thanks to a handful of other genes that affect my nerves. So the best I can ever do is try not to get a cold sore, but I can't control that completely. So I can be fine for six months and then barely functional for another six months just because of one cold sore and its aftermath. I can't really have a career, probably ever. And now I have to take care of my mom with dementia full time so there's no such thing as normal sleep; she keeps me awake 20+ hours of the day.
I gave up on carnivore because it was too restrictive and I'm responsible for cooking for other people. It helped with a lot of issues (zero dietary cold sore triggers, but I would still get some eventually) but it had its own issues too, like long-term I would start getting deficient in folate and calcium and some minerals, or I would sometimes get very averse to dietary fat and protein both and end up fasting, then end up extremely hungry and weak.
I actually had better weight loss on paleo eating a ton of honey, which is weird because otherwise only ketogenic diets work for me, but they stopped working until carnivore. You can see why your experiments interest me, for many years I have been trying to figure out why weight loss is so weird for me and doesn't exactly seem as linked to any particular macro as I would think.
Wow, that sounds way more complicated than even my situation :D You should look into getting some sort of alternative "career" where you just build value and don't need to go to an office/show up on time. Like being a writer maybe?
How does one avoid cold sores? I always assumed they just "happened."
This pains me a little so say as a long term ketoer, but hey, for some people glucose just works. Maybe a non-offensive starch would work, too?
Chili sardines in olive oil or mustard sardines are, ah, less unfun. I've been hovering just above 190 even though free chocolate donuts and chocolate chip cookies keep somehow coming into my hand. I am self-disciplined enough not to buy these things, but not to refuse them: "I can resist anything except temptation." - Oscar Wilde
I love your willingness to disprove your theories!
I have an anecdote to share about the shifting sleep an hour every day and carnivore. I’ve had the same thing my whole life, which I assumed is because of a variant of the CLOCK gene I have. People send me their genetic data sometimes to troubleshoot their chronic illness because that’s how I recovered from many of my issues. I can say that I’ve only seen two other people with the CLOCK gene variant I have, and they also have the same sleeping issue.
However, for the record, I have another genetic issue that could affect circadian rhythms, which is nonclassical congenital adrenal hyperplasia via 21-hydroxylase deficiency. That’s the enzyme that makes cortisol, so I don’t get the spike you’re supposed to get upon waking. Rather, when tested my body struggles all day to get my shitty enzymes to react, meaning I finallt get a cortisol spike around the time I ought to want to go to bed.
I did carnivore for six months back in 2019 and after about three months I would wake up at dawn feeling rested. Diet somehow overcome two big genetic influences.
My carnivore was only slightly strict by that point, however, and iirc around three months is also when I got cravings for greens and would sometimes make a pot of pigs feet with bitter greens and diced tomatoes.
I’ve never properly experimented with fiber in mind because mostly fiber used to destroy my GI lining, though I handle it fine now. And I don’t really pay attention to fat versus protein, just follow my appetite going through phases where I crave fat versus being a little averse to it.
Thanks! It's harder than it looks, because I'm really attached to my theories ;)
Interesting that you have the same/a similar issue. I think these are super rare, at least diagnosed. Most people who have circadian rhythm issues probably never get diagnosed and just go through life feeling tired and shitty the whole time.
So is your rhythm still under control now? Sounds like you gave up on carnivore? I've never gotten my genes tested, so not sure if that's the issue I have. But it could be.
Yeah, the other two people with the same CLOCK gene never had anything diagnosed, they just feel like life is more difficult, heh. I never had anything diagnosed either, I figured I just took after my father (which is apparently accurate as my mom does not have the variant).
It's actually never been especially important in my life to get my circadian rhythm under control; by the time I was in my 20s I was nearly bedbound from chronic illness so it didn't really matter which 16 to 20 hours of the day I slept. Then once my health recovered it was still too tenuous to keep a job; I have a recurring brain infection whenever I get cold sores and one outbreak wrecks me for months at a time thanks to a handful of other genes that affect my nerves. So the best I can ever do is try not to get a cold sore, but I can't control that completely. So I can be fine for six months and then barely functional for another six months just because of one cold sore and its aftermath. I can't really have a career, probably ever. And now I have to take care of my mom with dementia full time so there's no such thing as normal sleep; she keeps me awake 20+ hours of the day.
I gave up on carnivore because it was too restrictive and I'm responsible for cooking for other people. It helped with a lot of issues (zero dietary cold sore triggers, but I would still get some eventually) but it had its own issues too, like long-term I would start getting deficient in folate and calcium and some minerals, or I would sometimes get very averse to dietary fat and protein both and end up fasting, then end up extremely hungry and weak.
I actually had better weight loss on paleo eating a ton of honey, which is weird because otherwise only ketogenic diets work for me, but they stopped working until carnivore. You can see why your experiments interest me, for many years I have been trying to figure out why weight loss is so weird for me and doesn't exactly seem as linked to any particular macro as I would think.
Wow, that sounds way more complicated than even my situation :D You should look into getting some sort of alternative "career" where you just build value and don't need to go to an office/show up on time. Like being a writer maybe?
How does one avoid cold sores? I always assumed they just "happened."
This pains me a little so say as a long term ketoer, but hey, for some people glucose just works. Maybe a non-offensive starch would work, too?
Chili sardines in olive oil or mustard sardines are, ah, less unfun. I've been hovering just above 190 even though free chocolate donuts and chocolate chip cookies keep somehow coming into my hand. I am self-disciplined enough not to buy these things, but not to refuse them: "I can resist anything except temptation." - Oscar Wilde
Yea turns out the sardines are just a vehicle for chili/mustard ;) kind of like salad..
The first few times I tried Rebel ice cream, I could barely eat ⅓ pint. After a while, I could easily finish the whole pint.
It's obviously not the same as just cream, but I wonder if there's some satiety adaptation going on?
Could be, but weird that it would take 6 months?
Scott Alexander wrote something interesting about how to use melatonin to fix sleep phase disorders, in case you've not already tried that:
https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-than-you-wanted-to-know/
I'll check it out, thanks!