111 Comments
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

They don't really ever explain the motivation of the factions in Civil War but I'm going to assume they are "high fat" vs "high carb."

Expand full comment
author

Yes that was my impression.

Note how the guy had to wear red sunglasses because his eyes were so damaged from all the seed oils, too!

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

LOL!

Expand full comment
Jun 2·edited Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

> And the DEXA confirmed this. I got my lowest body fat % ever at 30.2%. My fat mass decreased by .4lb, and my lean mass increased by 4.5lbs.

Your DEXA graph shows you going from 32% to 30% body fat over the last month or so. Implying 4lb fat loss. Congratulations? And if you've replaced that with 4lbs of muscle even better. Scale weight schmale weight. But I think I must be confused.

Expand full comment
author

Well no, the DEXA says my fat mass went from 68.8lbs to 68.4lbs for a .4lb fat loss, while my lean mass went from 146lbs to 150.5lbs for a 4.5lbs gain.

Of course it could be something something water weight, making the lean gain "fake" in that sense. Or maybe it influenced the fat mass, too.

Expand full comment
Jun 3·edited Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

So you've actually gained 4lbs but it's all lean mass? Even then:

>>> 68.8/(68.8+146)

0.3202979515828678

>>> 68.4/(68.4+150.5)

0.3124714481498401

Graph looks more like 32% to 31% to 30% over the last month. Probably I'm just misreading something. Not to worry.

Expand full comment
author

Yea, pretty much:

31.9%

31.0%

30.2%

But of course fat% is influenced not just by fat, but also lean mass.

Expand full comment

> But of course fat% is influenced not just by fat, but also lean mass.

That's what I'm saying.

I can see how you get 32% and I can see how you would get 31.2%, but I am not seeing any numbers I can get either 31.0% or 30.2% from.

Expand full comment
author

total mass / fat mass

221.5 70.5

222.4 68.8

226.5 68.4

Expand full comment

Cool, and what are the dates for these? And the start and end date of ex150-10? Because that looks to me like 'over the last month and a bit I have lost 2lbs of fat and put on 7lbs of something else'. And given that you are actively trying to put on muscle and seem to be succeeding, that seems like cause for congratulation, rather than 'ex150-10 didn't work'.

For that matter, that DEXA graph is showing you losing body fat percentage at a steady rate, as fast as you ever have. The only interesting bit is July-September 2023, where it goes up fast instead.

From the DEXA graph I could actually buy: 'the only effect here is linoleic acid depletion slowly fixing homeostatic control of fat percentage, and that's happening slowly and steadily'.

Except for the July-September 2023 bit. What happened then?

Expand full comment
Jun 6Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Found the Python user ;)

Expand full comment
Jun 6·edited Jun 6Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Yay Python! Also no one would understand if I did it in lisp.

Expand full comment
Jun 2·edited Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

> It’s actually astonishing that my appetite would intuitively land at nearly the exact same number without me noticing.

I am not astonished, because homeostasis. Your appetite is the thing that gets you to eat the required number of calories, and it really is super accurate over long periods, which is why in normal operation your weight should stay stable over decades.

In fact, you have designed (and done) the ideal experiment to test this. Buy different brands of cream every week, and don't look at the labels just count the pots. If everything else stays the same, then I predict that you'll eat roughly the same number of calories every week, irrespective of the calorie density of the cream. As far as I can see, the only way that could be true is if your appetite is counting the calories for you.

Expand full comment
author

Yea it's pretty amazing how close it got. It made me crave another coffee, and when that wasn't enough, it made me make more than normal whipped cream for dinner, ending up within ~200kcal. And that might very well be measurement error or natural variance in the cream or whatever.

Expand full comment
Jun 3·edited Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

I think it's too accurate to be dead-reckoning. 200kcal is 28 grams at 7kcal/gram.

I think something somewhere has got a very precise weight or fat percentage or fatty-acid flux or something in mind, and it is going 'not enough:eat more', and 'too much: stop eating'. And medium-term, as long as you don't willpower, you weigh exactly what it wants you to weigh.

And (some of) the questions we're interested in are: Why does it suddenly go haywire when you eat protein? Why does it seem to be a bit higher than it should be even on ex150? Why does it seem to be returning to normal the longer you do this? And why is it that it sometimes seems to be tracking down and sometimes seem to be stable?

Expand full comment
author

Linoleic acid? :aliens.gif:

Expand full comment

Hmm, is linoleic acid becoming something of a curiosity-stopper for us?

I mean yes, *of course* it's linoleic acid. Its evil is subtle and omnipresent. But how *exactly* is the linoleic acid doing it?

In the library? with the lead pipe?

Expand full comment
author

We know the mechanisms: endocannabionid system, (lack of) ROS, ..

I don't think LA should be a curiosity stopper, but it's good enough to explain this phenomenon. If I plateau all summer but my LA goes down, and then I lose weight again, that'd be consistent with the LA buffer theory.

Expand full comment
Jun 5·edited Jun 5Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

> If I plateau all summer but my LA goes down, and then I lose weight again, that'd be consistent with the LA buffer theory.

If it's just LA depletion, then it should be a smooth process. If it's starting and stopping there's something else going on.

We don't know the mechanisms, we have some hand-wavy ideas about possible things. One can get to the right method, and indeed the right explanation, by any means, including luck and hand-waving and metaphor.

But we don't *know*, or even really understand, until we've got differential equations, can make accurate predictions, and have experimental techniques that prove every part of the suggested pathway beyond doubt.

And once you've got that level of understanding, you can usually do magic tricks.

Like, people have "known" for seventy years that polyunsaturated fats are good for the heart, because they are more liquid so they don't clog up your arteries. This is a great argument! We even know, I think, that blood cholesterol finds its way into the arterial plaques that raise your blood pressure and cause heart attacks.

And on this basis, it seems to me that medical "science" has actively supported the worst mass poisoning in history.

If we don't understand the gears, if we can't make predictions, we don't understand the machine.

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

When you were eating salmon, was it farmed or wild-caught?

Expand full comment
author

Wild-caught exclusively

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Well, that's a bummer!

Expand full comment
author

Yea, if you read my post on that, I'm still kinda split on salmon. I did get a whole bunch of "PUFA-seeming" things back that I didn't care for, and that are gone again now (~2 months later of no fish).

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

I wonder if that would be the same for wild-caught skipjack tuna....

Expand full comment
author

Tuna is extremely lean, almost no fat in there.

Expand full comment
Jun 4Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

I got the X3 early this year because of your review in December. It's taken me a long while to get into it as I've never done any strength training at all before and I didn't want to injure myself. I've given my body lots of breaks and if I notice any joint twinges I've skipped workouts liberally. But I'm now somewhere between 4 days and 6 days a week.

- Acclimatisation was a ride: the first time I did Front Squat I was in pain walking up and down stairs for 6 days (no exaggeration). I didn't do it again for over a week. BUT then after the second and every subsequent time: no soreness at all! Similar things in other workouts. I don't really understand how my body's response can change so much after just one workout... but well done body.

- In fact it's amazing how you don't get sore with it, only tired (VERY tired). They say this is a benefit of the X3 approach compared to weightlifting which I can't compare to - but I'm happy.

- Neck strain has been a challenge - my neck tenses up so much that sometimes I have to stop early to avoid pain. It seems to be getting better, slowly. Did you have anything like that?

- It's taken me a long time on many of the workouts to understand form (and I'm still working on Chest press tbh). BUT it's gratifying how when you get it right, you can really feel it because you can go to exhaustion so thoroughly

So anyway, thanks for bringing to my attention!

Expand full comment
author

Glad you enjoy it! I'm really liking mine still, too.

- I took a long time to get used to it, too. In fact I'd say the first 2-3 months I wasn't going all out ever, just subconsciously holding back & getting used to the equipment and lifting again after half a decade of not lifting.

- I had massive soreness too, and then it just went away when I cut back on volume. I don't think I've been sore this year yet! Not entirely sure why that happens haha, but in his book Jaquish describes this and I can confirm it..

- Neck strain - interesting, during which exercises? I haven't noticed this. I did notice I had some "mental blockers" e.g. I was always scared of squatting to depth. But the other day I did an air squat and realized I was comfortable going WAY lower than I would with x3. Then yesterday with x3 squats I went much deeper than normal - and it was fine! No knee pain like I used to get with weights. I think this mental thing was left over from my weight lifting days years ago, where squat depth meant knee pain. Maybe you have something like this with your neck? Not sure.

- Agreed on the exhaustion! Chest & triceps can be tricky because the bands want to slip off if you haven't placed them perfectly. But when you do get it and you can safely "run into the wall".. man does it feel great!

Expand full comment
Jun 6·edited Jul 13Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

The Chest press is also still a challenge for me, something I'm doing at the moment is put two loose velcro straps (like one would use for cables) around the band so the doubled over bands don't separate/tangle.

Expand full comment
Jun 4Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

So neck strain has been a problem on anything involving upper body - so everything except calf raise and front squats I guess. Overhead press was worst, on one occasion near the start I was in real pain.

But I’m prone to neck pain after sleeping funny and used to get “zoom neck” a lot if you know what I mean, so I think it’s me more than x3.

I’m hoping that a combination of trying hard to relax my neck and the neck muscles getting stronger will solve, and it’s already a lot better. I can often feel a ton of stabilisation firing around there even if the workout is technically nothing to do with neck.

Tricep press I’m a lot happier with once I discovered the method of crossing-over the bands behind my back. Solves the slipping really well, can share if you like. Chest press just can’t seem to get it feeling in my chest - am trying the “bend the bar like superman” approach and helping a bit maybe? Any tips would be appreciated!

Expand full comment
author

Hm, I guess I don't get that. Are you maybe leaning your neck forward too much, or subconsciously tensing it up? Can't really think of anything else :( Hopefully, working out will help with it?

I haven't tried the crossed triceps, do you have a link? I don't really feel the chest press in my chest either, more my triceps and shoulders tbh. Then again I don't like the Arnold chicken breast haha.

Expand full comment
Jun 5Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

This is the crossed band thing: feels really good for Tricep https://youtu.be/rjB67vJme0U

Expand full comment
author

Hm just tried it and didn't like it. Did a couple reps and felt like I was getting only 1/2 the expected resistance, lol. Like one of the bands isn't being used, just sitting there for stabilization.

So I went back to the usual style over the shoulders and the band didn't slip, and I crushed it - 40 reps dark gray :) So up to black band next time.

Expand full comment
author

Sweet, I actually have triceps press coming up tomorrow so I'll try it! Thanks

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Speaking of travel foods, it has recently come to my attention that a little $10 wheel of french brie from costco is, per quarter, 500 calories, 45 g fat, 25 g protein. Someone should do an ex150brie. If you do, try spreading butter on top of the whole brie before slicing it.

Expand full comment
author

"Quadruple cream brie" where the last cream is just dousing it in heavy cream

Expand full comment
Jun 10Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Hi again!

Just thinking - because everything has stabilized - it could be a good time to test supplements.

I’ve seen stallers getting things moving again with supplements like Berberine, Fenugreek or even Akkermansia Muciniphilia (bugs)

Could be interesting?..

Expand full comment
author

Yea I think I'll try a custom protein powder mix next, extra low in isoleucine.

Expand full comment
Jun 10Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Will be interesting! Hope you find a good tasting one.

I tried pea protein cos it’s low methionine but was completely inedible so that was the end of my pea protein era 😅

Expand full comment
author

Yea I didn't like pea either. Tried it years ago. Supposed to be very digestible but gave me the runs lol.

Expand full comment
Jun 11Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

🙈😅

Expand full comment
Jun 6Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Still wondering about why no fat loss?

Is it possible the exercise is making you eat more calories d

Expand full comment
Jun 6Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Do you think?..

I’m not sure whether to do resistance training while I’m trying to lose weight? Do have memory of getting hungrier after resistance training..

Expand full comment
author

Well, that's why I measured my calories on 2 days and find they hadn't actually increased much.. I used to get hungrier when I did starting strength with high protein, but now on ex150 and x3 I can't say I've noticed anything.

Expand full comment
Jun 6Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Woops sorry - should have read it again!

I wonder if the muscle building metabolic state prevents fat loss? 🤔

I.e you have to choose one or the other ? Or if it’s just something else entirely 🤷‍♀️

Expand full comment
author

Yea, I do wonder that too. It's honestly hard to say. Last summer I wasn't working out and still plateau'd. Who knows!

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

How maddening!

So funny when people say ‘just eat less and move more’ if only they knew.. 😅🙈 interesting that even the the fat fast didn’t change things.

The only thing I can think to try next would be going even lower calorie intermittently .

Anyway - I’ll be watching your intrepid continuing explorations into fat loss with great interest! 😄

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

summer= body uses less energy for thermogenesis

in the winter, your body needs to heat itself

calorie differences in BMR can be meaningful

Expand full comment
author

Yea that could definitely be. Although I do use the AC in the summer, but obviously I don't put it on freezing..

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Hi there, just making stabs in the dark here but have you tried calorie cycling so your body doesn’t get used to a particular calorie intake ? So you eat more one day then less the next - revving up thermogenesis then dropping calories the next day for a good calorie deficit?

Also - I wonder if you lose tolerance for protein - the more weight you lose? Maybe a fat fast would help then? Looking forward to seeing your results…

Also have you tried MCT oil? Some people seem to get results from that?

Expand full comment
author

I have done fat fasts recently. They are spectacular for water weight loss (I actually ended one just today! 7 days) but I didn't lose more than on regular ex150 after that.

I haven't consciously calorie cycled, but with my refeeds I'm sure I top 4-5kkcal/day a lot of the time.

I've used MCT years ago, but not recently. Cream is about 11% MCT though, so I'm getting some thru that.

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Oh I didnt know about the MCT in cream.. I wonder if it contributes to the satiety?

I wonder what would get the scale moving faster?

I still suspect methionine so was wondering about pea protein shakes? (Maybe losing tolerance for as much methionine as lose weight) obviously it doesn’t sound very exciting but I saw someone with one of the best weight loss results I’ve ever seen who was doing intermittent fasting with Huel shakes (pea protein) and he was having a lot of lower calorie days - like 1500 calorie days . Maybe dropping calories with low methionine protein and less high calorie fat. Maybe just have to be stricter with more weight loss - maybe a low leptin thing? Just throwing ideas lol

Expand full comment
author

Yea most people don't know about the MCT in cream, but it's right there: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Butterfat

I'm wondering too :) With only 150g of beef I'm already getting very low methionine. And even a 14 day fat fast didn't produce faster weight loss recently :(

I'm probably about the strictest person there is in dieting haha, unless by strict you mean "doing another protocol."

Good question though, I don't know :)

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

> The sun is supposed to be good for you!

Maybe it’s just daylight exposure rather than UV exposure? My sleep patterns change in the summer; maybe yours do, too?

> I probably hadn’t had macadamia nuts in 5 years prior to this.

I eat macadamias like you guzzle cream. They are wonderfully delicious!

My lunch nearly every day is:

• 2 cups plain Kefir

• 2 sticks of grass fed beef jerky (Chomps)

• 1/4 cup macadamias

• 6-8 oz of berries (black/blue/straw)

• 1 banana (sometimes)

• 2 Tbsp ground flax seeds

Costs about $10 (depending on produce prices), is 900 kcal, and almost exactly equal parts of each macronutrient.

And super high omega balance! It’s about 5.3g PUFA of which 3.3g is ω-3 so 62% omega balance.

Expand full comment
author

Well it's debatable if flax seed o3 is the same as animal o3. I think it's getting converted at a pretty bad ratio.

But overall this is very similar to the yogurt I made, except I didn't put jerky or bananas or flax in it :) But thick dairy (kefir/yogurt) with nuts & berries... amazing!

Expand full comment
Jun 5Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Yes, I’ve definitely seen a lot of claims about ALA to EPA/DHA conversion. But no real agreement of the claims.

Cate Shanahan claims that excess Linoleic Acid causes problems for the ALA -> EPA/DHA conversion, which I think is interesting. I think Tony Hulbert makes a similar argument in Omega Balance.

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Very interesting, may I ask the brand of heavy cream that you were using? I mostly use clover, there’s also access to raw heavy cream, but it’s more expensive $13 per 16 oz roughly 450 ml. I may be down to try the fat fast (heavy cream only vs raw heavy cream) and report results.

Expand full comment
author

The Whole Foods one with lower fat was this one I believe: https://www.wholefoodsmarket.com/product/organic-kalona%20whipping%20cream-b06zzb8jfq

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

why is there so much variance? Your link (Kalona, milk only ingredient) is 40cal, 4.5g fat and 0g carb. I recognize the rounding-to-zero issue, but mine (generic walmart heavy cream, has carrageenan, mono- and diglycerides, polysorbate 80) is 50 cal, 5g fat, 1g carbs. What brand had 6g fat?

Expand full comment
author

I think "cream" is defined as 30-36% fat or something. So Kalona is at the lower end, yours is high-mid, and most brands I see are 6g. (6g would be 40%, maybe they're rounding up.)

Yours may in fact be the same as mine, except they rounded down (5g = 33%) instead of up (6g = 40%). I think 35-36% is quite normal in cream.

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

This is America. You see the "how much sawdust can you put in a rice crispy treat before someone notices" meme? That's us, every day. We started the global obesity pandemic by doing that with cottonseed in the lard, and literally by the time the French inventor of beef-tallow margarine brought his product to market in 1871 an American had already filed a patent for making it with seed oil in it.

So step back a second and ask yourself why on earth an american food company would give you real heavy cream if it's legal to thicken-up something closer to half-and-half with gums and diglycerides?

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Sure, I believe you, I am just curious 1) how much of a negative effect it would have and 2) which brand can I get without that negative effect?

Expand full comment
Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Oh gotcha. I had meant to spell out that buying local is the only solution I personally have. As for the effects, we're already facing a death of a thousand cuts, might as well avoid this one of possible.

Expand full comment
Jun 3·edited Jun 3Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

Definitely, and I'm consuming a lot of it, so even if the effect is incremental, it probably adds up.

What should I be aiming for on the label? One ingredient: milk? 6g fat? Any other red flags?

Expand full comment
Jun 2Liked by Experimental Fat Loss

This might not be a great time for raw dairy products, with the recent bird flu infecting cows.

Expand full comment